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rooboy27

Escort MK1 rear brake setup help required

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Hi, im new to the forum - so be gentle.

Im after some help please. Im building a Locost kit car, using a English Axle from an Escort MK1 i believe and the rear brakes have the single piston cylinder. My question is, when the handbrake cable is pulled, is it supposed to only push out one of the brake pads - and the other is not used? Or does the adjuster have anything to do with pushing out the second pad? 

I have replaced the cylinders, shoes, springs etc.. but when i pull the handbrake the lever is extended all the way but i can still rotate the wheel - with some resistance. I wondered if the second pad needed to be engaged to provide better stopping power? Is it a case that the adjuster is seized - or is that just a manual adjuster that plays no part? 

Picture attached. Front of the car to the EDIT: right LEFT of the picture. I have since switched the left brake shoe round (so that the top of the shoe in the pic is at the bottom now, if that makes sense).

EDIT: Likewise, if the cylinder is pushed out when pressing the brake pedal, only one pad is pushed out. Am i missing an interlinking unit on this set up - this is all it originally came with when i bought the axle off ebay.

Thanks

Mark

UYTG4734.JPG

Edited by rooboy27
more info

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On a single acting h/brake mechanism the arm pushes one shoe and the cylinder sliding pushes the other shoe. Shoes have leading edges and going by your pic pending which side it is the shoes are fitted incorrectly. The leading edge is the end of the shoe showing the most metal before the friction material. So on the near side rear the leading edge is bottom right on the right hand shoe and top left on the left hand shoe. Offside the leading edge is bottom left and top right. Hope you followed that.

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Yep, as Col say's its all to do with "Reaction & opposite reaction", and when set up correctly, is quite efficient, but not to the degree of a rear disc brake on a modern car, above all, and Col will prob agree, everything needs to be clean, smooth, with a very small amount of copper slip on the pivots and sliding mechanism of the cylinder in the back plate, and I do mean very small amounts of copper slip.

 

Al.

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Agree with Al above on the lubrication. With the shoes removed the cylinder should slide quite easily from side to side. Usually a build up of corrosion on the backplate hinders this and not only reduces efficiency but also cause the brakes to bind. Taking another look at your pic the shoe retainers are missing.

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16 minutes ago, caprimk1v4 said:

Yep, as Col say's its all to do with "Reaction & opposite reaction", and when set up correctly, is quite efficient, but not to the degree of a rear disc brake on a modern car, above all, and Col will prob agree, everything needs to be clean, smooth, with a very small amount of copper slip on the pivots and sliding mechanism of the cylinder in the back plate, and I do mean very small amounts of copper slip.

 

Al.

 

4 minutes ago, Ray said:

the H plates and springs are also missing

God, what an accumulation of old gits on here remembering shoe brake set ups....lol

bet not to many remember ROD brakes.....I’ll just get my simmer frame 🤭

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Ha, nope, no rod brakes for me, but have had to throw out an Anchor the odd time through the window to stop some of the cack I have had to service/work on !!??, 

I'm just off to change me incontinent pants, before I liquidize my dinner and soak me teeth in Steradent !!!!!!!!. "What time does the Nurse come to put the cream on me piles" !!??

 

I THANK YOU.

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3 hours ago, colr6 said:

On a single acting h/brake mechanism the arm pushes one shoe and the cylinder sliding pushes the other shoe. Shoes have leading edges and going by your pic pending which side it is the shoes are fitted incorrectly. The leading edge is the end of the shoe showing the most metal before the friction material. So on the near side rear the leading edge is bottom right on the right hand shoe and top left on the left hand shoe. Offside the leading edge is bottom left and top right. Hope you followed that.

@colr6 thanks for the info, yes i think i follow that. I realise now this is a picture before i had put the springs and shoe retainers on. Im glad you mentioned the sliding of the cylinder too - i forgot to mention that in my write up - but mine is doing that and i thought it was a another problem!!! phew - glad its working as designed.  

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3 hours ago, Ray said:

the H plates and springs are also missing

@Ray thanks. I had to look up what these were - and you are quite right - those are not in place - didnt come with any so i will need to source some. Many thanks for the advice

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Very nice, and I love that colour combo, it really suits the shape and lines of the car, as no doubt a lot where in BLACK.

 

That lighter green looks very similar to a colour Ford used in the late 70's early 80's as Highland Green !!??, it used to look very nice on Capri MK3 "S" models, the black "S" decals really showing off the green.

 

Bet that's got Rod brakes !!?? PLUS AN ANCHOR. ??!!. 

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3 hours ago, accord83 said:

Size of that rim, it must be Australian. 😁

This is such fake news! I have never even seen one of these big wheeled donk things on the road in my entire life ever! Outside of Street Machine Magazine and America I think its all made up!

BTW I wouldn't be pointing the finger at Australia for a carriage donk fetish if I were you! Right you are Ma'am. 🎩

QueenCoach.jpg.79d3555df3d569d7d6d13f3c70d74fa1.jpg

 

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You're just jealous that our country is old enough to have proper antiques, (and old carriages!)😂😂 

 

Is that Wee Jimmy Krankie in the cap peeping out of the centre window?

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12 minutes ago, accord83 said:

You're just jealous that our country is old enough to have proper antiques, (and old carriages!)😂😂 

 

Is that Wee Jimmy Krankie in the cap peeping out of the centre window?

Hahahaha Except that one pictured was built in Australia this century as an 80th birthday gift for the Queen! So I guess we do build fancy parade donks after all, but for the British export market! LOL

(No its Nicola Sturgeon bumming a free ride)

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1 minute ago, Rally Pack 2000 said:

Hahahaha Except that one pictured was built in Australia this century as an 80th birthday gift for the Queen! So I guess we do build fancy parade donks after all, but for the British export market! LOL

(No its Nicola Sturgeon bumming a free ride)

Nicola Sturgeon is measuring it up ready for her coronation as Scotlands Queen come her devolution dream!🤣🤣

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11 minutes ago, accord83 said:

Nicola Sturgeon is measuring it up ready for her coronation as Scotlands Queen come her devolution dream!🤣🤣

LOL In F1 they call it a seat fitting.

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1 hour ago, Rally Pack 2000 said:

This is such fake news! I have never even seen one of these big wheeled donk things on the road in my entire life ever! Outside of Street Machine Magazine and America I think its all made up!

BTW I wouldn't be pointing the finger at Australia for a carriage donk fetish if I were you! Right you are Ma'am. 🎩

QueenCoach.jpg.79d3555df3d569d7d6d13f3c70d74fa1.jpg

 

 

73ab3cf7f5aa0c3f0cafda353676cd21.jpg

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On 14/01/2020 at 15:35, colr6 said:

On a single acting h/brake mechanism the arm pushes one shoe and the cylinder sliding pushes the other shoe. Shoes have leading edges and going by your pic pending which side it is the shoes are fitted incorrectly. The leading edge is the end of the shoe showing the most metal before the friction material. So on the near side rear the leading edge is bottom right on the right hand shoe and top left on the left hand shoe. Offside the leading edge is bottom left and top right. Hope you followed that.

@colr6 sorry to be a pain mate.

ive done all that has been said. Fitted H plates, swapped left disc pad around, applied grease and also the spring clips. When applying the handbrake - the pad attached to the handbrake moves, the cylinder moves down and hence the other brake pad. When releasing the handbrake though- it does not return to its starting position - so will rub on drum. 
what you think I’m missing?

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21 minutes ago, rooboy27 said:

@colr6 sorry to be a pain mate.

ive done all that has been said. Fitted H plates, swapped left disc pad around, applied grease and also the spring clips. When applying the handbrake - the pad attached to the handbrake moves, the cylinder moves down and hence the other brake pad. When releasing the handbrake though- it does not return to its starting position - so will rub on drum. 
what you think I’m missing?

If the brake shoes arent returning then its most likely the brake shoe retracting springs that clamp the shoes together arent operating correctly. From what I can see you have the springs mounted behind the shoes (although I cant see the top one). According to the manual diagram the top one is mounted from behind but the one closest to the cylinder is mounted on the front. It may be jamming as a result. Possibly try remounting that spring on the front?

BrakeShoeDiagram.thumb.jpg.7d79728a935b572bf79460deadd11416.jpg

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With the drum off the only shoe that will return to its original position is the one done by the h/ brake lever. If the other one doesn’t return then the springs are weak. You will always have some bind till the small amount of run out on the drum knocks the trailing shoe back.

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