Russian Bear Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 You gotta love mk2 Consuls!! Ive just got rid of my mk2 Consul as its previous owner, my brother in law, wanted it back as he wished he'd never sold it...Fair enough!! Now he's found me another to replace that last one, this... KarPhotos005 by greg.ikin, on Flickr Now i know this kar aswell... but ive been thinkin of all kindsa engine changes for it all ready...on the basis that it wont be my daily but used more often or not!! engines running through my head have been anything from ST 2.5 turbo to Fiesta RS Turbo, Zetec to ST24/200/Jaguar 3ltr V6, Crossflows to Pinto's. All of the above might sound absolutely awesome in theory, but practically, realistically and useably with a period twist, whats wrong with the original inline 4 engine?? Does the original inline 4 1703cc have any tuning qualities?? I like the idea that something of a nostalgia notion could be put into play to hop the engine up in a period ethos...people stick to their pre-crossflows and crossflows dont they?? Has anyone had any experience with tuning this engine, maybe getting cam reground? Ported n Polished the head? Put a 4 branch on? or am i wasting my time with such thoughts, it will be a costly exercise and i might as well put a Pinto in?? Im not looking to mad, around 120bhp would suffice!! And i want to keep the Column change!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted November 30, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Does the 1703cc Consul inline 4 share any characteristics of the Pre-Crossflow baring in mind the inlets and exhaust are shared on the same side?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caprilaser Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 Sorry mate but I don't know much about these other than that they look pretty sweet! Nice car. How much room is there in the engine bay, not tempted to squeeze in a V6? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomber1 Posted November 30, 2010 Report Share Posted November 30, 2010 mk3 straight 6 for that kind of grunt imo. check out www.galeforcezephyrs.com i think there are tunning bits like raymond mays heads as per the 6s but its going to be expensive and hard to find/ equally as expensive. if you dont want to go with 6/8 cylinders a pinto/pre/xflow would be good but a modern lump would be better imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escort21 Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 essex v6 would give you grunt and a proper oldskool sound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arfur Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Greg, smoke around with the four-pot until it blows up, then fit whatever comes up cheap. Job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mk2Jo Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 ^^^^ What he said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Sorry mate but I don't know much about these other than that they look pretty sweet! Nice car. How much room is there in the engine bay, not tempted to squeeze in a V6? I had a Zephyr a couple of kars gone by and there was loadsa room for the Cologne lump i put in, the Consul is approx 6 inches shorter...it can be done but with a smaller space...i mean if people can put Essex lumps in 100e's!! mk3 straight 6 for that kind of grunt imo. check out www.galeforcezephyrs.com i think there are tunning bits like raymond mays heads as per the 6s but its going to be expensive and hard to find/ equally as expensive. if you dont want to go with 6/8 cylinders a pinto/pre/xflow would be good but a modern lump would be better imo Bomber i like your period thinkin!! its what i was limbering up to do with the last Consul that my bro in law bought back because it had the bulk head cut and moved. My intention was to get it to fit, Port n Polish the Mk3 straight 6, 2x 3-1 headers and run bike carbs (thankyou Classic Ford Mag i want to fit them to everything now!!) and top that off with a mk3 3 4 speed column change!! sounds good in theory but the engine needs to in effect move further into the kar, not a problem but i couldnt get my head around linkgages etc for the gearbox??? Greg, smoke around with the four-pot until it blows up, then fit whatever comes up cheap. Job done. ^^^^ What he said Im right in thinkin that you guys are thinkin what i was thinkin (still with me??), that its not worth the expense tuning the original engine because if it really was their would be more about it and we wouldnt be having this discussion now!! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken B Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Does the 1703cc Consul inline 4 share any characteristics of the Pre-Crossflow baring in mind the inlets and exhaust are shared on the same side?? Other than they were both Fords and wheeze like an asthmatic schoolboy, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Does the 1703cc Consul inline 4 share any characteristics of the Pre-Crossflow baring in mind the inlets and exhaust are shared on the same side?? Other than they were both Fords and wheeze like an asthmatic schoolboy, no. Damn It!! Right then it will be smoked around until i see something that tickles me fancy... Oh yeah id better pay for the kar first, always helps!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomber1 Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Bomber i like your period thinkin!! its what i was limbering up to do with the last Consul that my bro in law bought back because it had the bulk head cut and moved. My intention was to get it to fit, Port n Polish the Mk3 straight 6, 2x 3-1 headers and run bike carbs (thankyou Classic Ford Mag i want to fit them to everything now!!) and top that off with a mk3 3 4 speed column change!! sounds good in theory but the engine needs to in effect move further into the kar, not a problem but i couldnt get my head around linkgages etc for the gearbox??? linkages would be ok if you used a mk3 coloum complete then should match up. i have two o/d mk3 boxes and a spares 4speed box could do a deal with my colom and linkages? as im going v8 all this is going on ebay eventurlly. ps could u not use zephyr front wings to give u the lehgth back or is the chassis shorter on the concul? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Bomber i like your period thinkin!! its what i was limbering up to do with the last Consul that my bro in law bought back because it had the bulk head cut and moved. My intention was to get it to fit, Port n Polish the Mk3 straight 6, 2x 3-1 headers and run bike carbs (thankyou Classic Ford Mag i want to fit them to everything now!!) and top that off with a mk3 3 4 speed column change!! sounds good in theory but the engine needs to in effect move further into the kar, not a problem but i couldnt get my head around linkgages etc for the gearbox??? linkages would be ok if you used a mk3 coloum complete then should match up. i have two o/d mk3 boxes and a spares 4speed box could do a deal with my colom and linkages? as im going v8 all this is going on ebay eventurlly. ps could u not use zephyr front wings to give u the lehgth back or is the chassis shorter on the concul? Ill look into the chassis length, it might be that bulkhead forward the whole cars longer?? Have you got a mk3 engine lying around aswell?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
you'll get 10s on that Posted December 1, 2010 Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Consul is about 6" if not more shorter in the front wings. Straight 6 will nit fit...well it will but the front pulley is in the grill so you would need bulkhead mods or some weird rad install to the side???? Consul gearbox will bolt up to 6 but from memory you need to use the consul clutch and flywheel as the Zeph/Zody flywheel wont fit inside the bellhousing (I did this conversion some 30 years ago and got as far as the rad issue and gave up) No sure about tuning potential of 1703 but the hockey stick exhaust manifold must be able to approved on!! and in fairness in good order these engines are fantastic motorway cars. "Best" option is v6 essex but you will need Zodiac mk4 sump and pickup pipe and front timing cover. Auto box is easiest . Juat weld the redundant clutchpedal to the break or remove. 375 front discs are enough to stop the car with the engine swap. Rear axle is ok for a standard v6 even with spirited use and burnouts but you will need to convert to MK3 Zeph/Zody diff which bolts straight in and fits the Csul half shafts but gets rid of the weak u bolts that connect the prop on the original Consul. From memory the Zody auto diff was ideal. Original Cosul rad in good order is man enough. Good Luck With Project Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 1, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2010 Nice one "You'll get 10s on that" its good to hear that someone else has tried it and im not completely mad!! I think the fact that you gave up is enough for me to look at other options, and maybe tune a straight 6 when i get another Zephyr someday!! as suggested i'll just use the Consul I4 (i have been advised its the higher compression Zephyr 4 engine aswell) maybe try a couple of carbs and change the exhaust... Bomber1 thanks for the offer of selling me the boxes and linkages i think its gona be too much hassle to get the straight 6 in... but still interested as im thinking of converting to 4 speed which shouldnt be a problem knowing what the engines come from... just PM when ready and we can discuss!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 2, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2010 Thinking outside the box... What would be needed to convert it to a carb based low pressure junkyard turbo setup?? I know it sounds mad!! But why not?? even the Zephyr 4 engine has low compression 8:3:1... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cozmic Posted December 2, 2010 Report Share Posted December 2, 2010 Tuning the 2553 straight six zodiac engine is quite expensive with few real term gains to be had: Raymond mays head, triple carbs,extractor manifold will yield about 116 bhp which is about all the standard clutch can cope with (it was always only just adequate). Fuel consumption with that little lot would be around 12 mpg Old ford auto can supply you with a complete front suspension/steering setup which will allow you to bolt a pinto straight in with the benefit of capri steering/suspension/brakes to boot, admittedly not cheap as it has to be done all in one go but a good end result, especially as the pinto has huge tuning potential. Having said that as a lot of people have already said the engine bay is pretty big so loads of options I know an essex slots in with no baulkhead mods required, so time to decide which direction you want to go in hope some of that helped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomber1 Posted December 3, 2010 Report Share Posted December 3, 2010 Thinking outside the box... What would be needed to convert it to a carb based low pressure junkyard turbo setup?? I know it sounds mad!! But why not?? even the Zephyr 4 engine has low compression 8:3:1... get a manifold sorted and try it i have a block but theres two big holes in it. the other engine i had i sold to a guy localy who races a tvr with the ford zodiac engine. hes tuned his to around 200bhp but thats with non standard manifolds but still with a steel head. but they dont last very long in that state of tune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cozmic Posted December 4, 2010 Report Share Posted December 4, 2010 WOW 200 bhp out of a 2553 six is very impressive that must be pretty much at it,s limit, as you say I can imagine that it won't last long if most of the internals are stock, the engineering tolerances are pretty slack in there A friend of mine ran a mk3 zody with a full raymond mays head/ carbs and manifold and it produced nowhere near that amount and lasted about 2 years. As far as I,m aware the weakest parts are the main bearings and big ends and obviously the head ,pre xflow was never a brilliant way to go due to poor flow characteristics and valve bounce at higher revs. I have heard of people boring the block and using 2.8i pistons (with suitable machine work) which would increase power over stock and enable you to lower compression ratio to suit a turbo better. The biggest problem facing a carb turbo setup is the carb pressurisation I know renault managed it as did suzuki on a bike engine. a normal carb will normally fail to hold pressure properly, but searching the web further may help you find a solution good luck looking forward to hearing how you progress with this if you run into any problems feel free to message me I have 10 years engineering experiance although I haven,t done much recently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
you'll get 10s on that Posted December 6, 2010 Report Share Posted December 6, 2010 Well if your going to turbo the original lump why not start with these http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lotus-Esprit-Turb ... 3f057e0d13 Either use one and sell one or use both...make your manifold and away you go GOOD LUCK (you may need it!!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russian Bear Posted December 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2010 Thanks for everyones input to date im gona have a ponder as to whats gona be easier, amass some parts over xmas and in the new year experiment ooh ah ah!!!... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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