Has the "Cossie" had its day?

[Copey]

don't shout at me too much here!

 

but seein that zetec capri in CF and the vid of it runnin a 9.7 1/4 and another of it beating a cossie powered mk1 has got me thinking

 

the cossie is an 80's engine based on a 70's base, back in the day it was a massive power engine and i guess today it still is, but the price they go for now is just stupid for the age of engine! i know a lot of people will argue the "iconic" persona of the engine is the reason they want them and thats fine

 

but a lot of people buy them just for performance value alone, and although they still put out big power in anything more than mild tune they become stupidly unreliable and cost a hell of a lot when they go bang

 

now stay with me here, i think zetecs are gonna take over, they can be tuned to fook and are still reliable and although people will argue "it costs just as much as a cossie to install anyway" which is a fair point, but when a zetec goes bang they are £100-200 to replace, which is CHEAP when compared to a cossie!! and you can get a BRAND NEW 2ltr zetec for £700 which is far cheaper than a 20+ year old cossie

 

in my opinion the cossie has past it now

 

what are other peoples views?

[l j shaw]

Give it a few years then the zetec will be replaced with something better and cheaper.

 

Progression is fact, but thats why we have oldskool cars, and challenge ourselves everyday to keep them alive, with which ever engine we can fit in them.

[NeilT]

totaly agree with every thing your saying copey i think your spot on

 

but what i will say is there ppl out the still builing pinto's and x-flows even though you you could bung in a xe or a zetect in for the same money and have more power so i think the cossie ant going anywhere but its days as king may be on there way out imho

[willsy]

I aggree, but personally, whatever ,you can't beat the noise of a properly sorted Pinto or Cross flow

[RossMK2]

i prefer x/flow's and pinto's

 

theres a new ford engine coming out

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/15/embargo-9-15-09-5am-edt-frankfurt-2009-ford-unveils-the-1-6-li/

[Noodles]

It depends what your into, i did a pinto cos its a old skool engine in a old skool car im not saying zetecs etc are wrong its just down to builders tastes

[andygfc]

It's gonna cost a bit more than £200 to get a zetec running 9.7 1/4's I think

And yes you do hear of cossies becoming unreliable when hitting high hp (and by that I mean a bit more than just mildly tuned) , but that's not the case for all tuned cossies.

I'm sure zetecs and duratecs will become more widely used, but I'm also sure the cosworth will be around for a long time yet

[PIG]

as said cossie engines aint cheap but how reliable is that zetez doing 9's and how much work money has gone in to.

keep a cossie at stage 2/3 and you will have no problems with it provided you have right cooling and oil issues addressed.atmo cossies i know of a few atmo cossies that have shit them selves on lots of occassions but they are not aways talked about,zetecs wont give huge power etc imo althought for 170hp are cheap to replace if they pop.i can see the duretec standing the test as still newish and already hitting near the magical 300(some over if on the right rollers haha)pintos and crossflows have been around for ever as well but if built right make very good and very reliable power.look at tobys,ht racing,hpe,aston etc.horses for courses still.although all the atmo boys love talking about the blowing up of the cossie turbos.a duretec is my next port of call for sure

[Copey]

It's gonna cost a bit more than £200 to get a zetec running 9.7 1/4's I think

 

if you re-read i said they cost similar to fit n set up but replacement zetecs are £200 if the original goes bang

[4DOOR-SHERWOOD]

I see what your saying but at the end of the day a zetec doesnt have the same ring to it as cosworth! I think that it will always be desirable just as the x/flow and pinto are!

I love to see different engines in an OSF and the new project im building has a 240bhp XE going into it, purely because they are readily available, cheap to buy (in standard form) and I like them!

Zetecs and duratecs are also a great engine and will probably be getting fitted for years to come in all different forms ie. turbo, carbs, throttle bodies etc...

I dont think its time has gone... not in my eyes!

[sambo]

I think cossies are cheap! For an iconic, great lookng engine that is at home in any ford, they go for around £1500.

 

£1500 for 220bhp is peanuts in my book. With a few extra punds chucked at it you can have a reliable 330BHP no problem.

 

Comparing that to these jap engines that lots of people are turning to, with all the installation costs and headaches with the fabrication required.... The cossie is still the king by a long shot.

 

You try getting 220BHP out of a Zetec for £1500.

[Copey]

You try getting 220BHP out of a Zetec for £1500.

 

fair enough Sambo, but try gettin a replacement cossie for £200

[sambo]

I just cant see the appeal of fitting zetecs or jap motors or wierd engines from some FWD car etc.

It may be a Gaz'ism but it is true.

 

To build and fit a 220bhp Zetec properly in a MK1 escort would cost around 7K. Maybe a bit less if your clever, so exchanging the engine when it blows up for a rear ended mondeo isnt gonna have 220bhp is it?

Total false economy.

 

Yes, your argument works if your comparing a std Zetec install. You can rag the tits out of it without the fear of an expensive re-build etc but you wont have much more than 150BHP in the first place.

[Copey]

its hardly false econemy, i have seen zetecs in and tuned to more than 220bhp for less than 2k, where you are gettin 7k from i have no idea, unless youre gonna pay for someone else to do everything?

 

and the point of the cheap replacement is that you can swap over all the bits from the turbo'd engine onto the new block and maybe have to replace a couple of bits, still probably cost under £500 to replace once the engine is initially installed, or you can go on buyin 1500 cossies to replace a blown engine with

 

face it, the cossies days are numbered

[5hane]

Imo i would go for the cossy over the zetec anyday.

 

 

300 bhp is easy, and full steel internals as standard!

 

 

also looks ace

[Retromotorsport]

You try getting 220BHP out of a Zetec for £1500.

 

fair enough Sambo, but try gettin a replacement cossie for £200

 

Neil Roper does ..for less ..

Port bored, bronze guides. This head for use with 34mm inlet and 30mm exhaust. Also, tappet buckets machined to 32mm. £869.00 including VAT

 

His blue printed engines bang out 200 all day.. cam change and Tbs 230

[4DOOR-SHERWOOD]

It just depends on what u want! personally I love the fact mine has a YB in it....and if you worry about how much they cost to replace then it obviously isnt an engine option you should take!

[harris horse power]

i see your point but , theres loads of cossie's out there running 9's and under , plus i think they are over rated , a friend of mine has a 190 bhp zetec in a mk1 fiesta and i have a 160bhp xflow in mine and we both run identical times of 13.27.

[over_head_cam]

It's probably been said before, but lots of people belied that the days of the Crossflow and the Pinto were numbered, but I'm sure they will continue for many more years. Personal choice doesn't always run hand in hand with cost and/or available horsepower

[Mexico]

down to personal preference at the end of the day like any part you bolt on to your own car. But personally, I cannot wait to bolt a N/A cossie head on my 205 block

[Fiesta Steve]

i see your point but , theres loads of cossie's out there running 9's and under , plus i think they are over rated , a friend of mine has a 190 bhp zetec in a mk1 fiesta and i have a 160bhp xflow in mine and we both run identical times of 13.27.

 

KP's?? Thats Zetec is a BIG money build from what I understand, steel everything etc..

 

So more 'bucks' but only the same 'bang' as a Crossflow.

[w p e]

so how many zetec parts are in this 9 sec engine? not many i would say.

block and head casing is probley about it. but as to your question at the start of this thread NO the cossie aint at its end not all the time i've got a hole up my arse anyway

[sambo]

its hardly false econemy, i have seen zetecs in and tuned to more than 220bhp for less than 2k, where you are gettin 7k from i have no idea, unless youre gonna pay for someone else to do everything?

 

and the point of the cheap replacement is that you can swap over all the bits from the turbo'd engine onto the new block and maybe have to replace a couple of bits, still probably cost under £500 to replace once the engine is initially installed, or you can go on buyin 1500 cossies to replace a blown engine with

 

face it, the cossies days are numbered

 

Fully installed for less than 2K running aftermarket management?

The water rail and sump and ECU will come to nearly that!

Then you have to worry about steel components for reliabilty and so on.

There is no way in hell the Zetec will ever be more desirable or cheaper to fit in an old ford than a cossie when looking at over 220BHP.

You can fit a std cossie on a car for about 3.5K. Thats 220bhp fitted. Steel internals, proven tuning mods to come later. On a factory ECU.

 

To get that from a Zetec..... reliably?...... and with true power figures too?......You have to be crazy to opt for a turbo zetec over a Cosworth YB.

 

[rallyesport04]

zetec is good but i think duratec has already proved itself an i personaly find a duratec more desirable but cossie is oldskool an looks at home in my mk1 so for now the yb is staying. yb's arent all that expensive if you use standard parts it gets expensive as soon as you start upgrading there reliable if you dont thrash the arse of them constantly boost them up to high etc etc my sap has done 106,000 all its had is a head gasket an turbo running stage 1 its a bit smoky now but its still goin

[sambo]

zetec is good but i think duratec has already proved itself an i personaly find a duratec more desirable but cossie is oldskool an looks at home in my mk1 so for now the yb is staying. yb's arent all that expensive if you use standard parts it gets expensive as soon as you start upgrading there reliable if you dont thrash the arse of them constantly boost them up to high etc etc my sap has done 106,000 all its had is a head gasket an turbo running stage 1 its a bit smoky now but its still goin

 

I agree, the only other engine in recent years to make such an impact has been the Duratec.

Even so, before i went down the N/A Cossie route, i looked into going for a Duratec. The cost of tuning and fitting one into an escort was just silly.

For 240BHP, i think the cost was around 8K plus VAT. Ok, that was from a reputed tuning company and i could probably got it done cheaper but even so, all that hassle and fabrication...... i rather just fit a 205 block in there and be done with it.