V8s?

[Dom]

Hullo!

 

Right now this is for the distant future but whenever i'm old enough I want to convert the capri to a v8. At the moment i've got a 3.5 rover lump in the garage but my uncles got a 351 from a mustang in his shed that needs rebuilding.

 

Which one would be more worthwhile fitting? I also read somewhere that a ford v8 with ally heads doesn't weigh too much more than an essex

 

Thanks very muchly

[bomber1]

right im the first to vote and chose the ford lump cos its a ford in a ford plus its bigger cc's imo any v8 sounds the dogs danglys

[DarrenM]

I think that may have been me who said that about the 302. Sell the 351 and Rover and go for a 302!

( I'm biased as I have the 302 with ally heads in my Capri!)

[Vista]

None of the above.

 

My vote is for Alfa Romeo, why? well look at the technology in it that comes as standard: -

 

All Alloy light weight engine with low C of G

Dry sump

Quad Cam

Spica Fuel injection

 

Granted it's only 2.6 litres but in stock trim it is 230bhp SAE and whilst I'm not sure what can be achieved with the fuel injection, if you replace it with a triple downdraught set up with some porting and flowing of the heads etc a lot more is achieveable.

 

Oh and it's much lighter than them simplistic Yank pig iron things.

[johnny_h]

I went for ford simply because when i was a nipper my old man bought a SDI Vittesse and it blew up on the drive home.

[deluxe]

doesnt the 351 weigh about the same as the rest of the car and make it understeer? (like this vectra on topgear)

[DarrenM]

http://www.team.net/sol/tech/engine.html

 

Have a look on here for some engine weights. 302 with ally heads and intake is around 400lbs and the standard Essex 3.0 is 379. 3.0 = 138 BHP my 302 = 320+

[V8ian]

None of the above.

 

My vote is for Alfa Romeo, why? well look at the technology in it that comes as standard: -

 

All Alloy light weight engine with low C of G

Dry sump

Quad Cam

Spica Fuel injection

 

Granted it's only 2.6 litres but in stock trim it is 230bhp SAE and whilst I'm not sure what can be achieved with the fuel injection, if you replace it with a triple downdraught set up with some porting and flowing of the heads etc a lot more is achieveable.

 

Oh and it's much lighter than them simplistic Yank pig iron things.

 

 

If youare talking Montreal engine, great engine, and is for arguments sake a de tuned F1 engine, there used to be one in a Dutton possibly in the Dartford area that sounded mental

As for V8s you sat 351, C or W, totaly different engines but the heads will interchange with a bit of machining. and both engines have a different firing order, but the cams will interchange, and the later firing order on the 5.0w has the same firing order as the cleveland.

[Vista]

If you are talking Montreal engine, great engine, and is for arguments sake a de tuned F1 engine, there used to be one in a Dutton possibly in the Dartford area that sounded mental

As for V8s you sat 351, C or W, totaly different engines but the heads will interchange with a bit of machining. and both engines have a different firing order, but the cams will interchange, and the later firing order on the 5.0w has the same firing order as the cleveland.

 

Yes mate that's exactly what I'm on about, and I have one sat in the garage, albeit in my Montreal

 

Oh and I also know when one can be had if somebody wants a different V8

[Dom]

Cleveland or Windsor, phhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh can't remember. Is one better than the other?

 

I think it might be out of a Mach 1 so I dunno which

 

Hey vista! How much?

[Vista]

I'm not sure but could find out if you want me too.

 

A word of warning though, they're very rare beasts and to fix them when they go wrong costs the earth. For instance I've just rebuilt mine and a set of main and big end bearings complete with thrust washers was the best part of £650 and had to come from Italy.

 

Get a good one though and they're fabulous!

[novanut64]

as v8ian said you need to know if the 351 is a windsor or a cleveland

i belive a windsor fits a capri easier as the dimensions of a windsor are

similar to an essex v6 and tuning parts are moore available and cheaper

for a windsor

[Dom]

when I saw your name I thought 'Pleeeeeeeeeeeeease be a chevy nova '

[novanut64]

the clues in the siggy mate 64

check the link

(its the wife whos got the mk1 rs)

[V8ian]

as v8ian said you need to know if the 351 is a windsor or a cleveland

i belive a windsor fits a capri easier as the dimensions of a windsor are

similar to an essex v6 and tuning parts are moore available and cheaper

for a windsor

 

Hi Paul Bout time you got thar car finished, Damn Yankies this year at the weald??

[novanut64]

its only been 12 years ian no point in rushing it

i have droped out of the club but i belive the static

show is on in may

also on may 20th rwyb at north weald

[Gonzo]

even though i got a rv8 in the shed, i voted 351 cuz you got more power on tap and bigger cc from the off and you got so many millions of bolt-on go-faster bits it's criminal. you try finding that many tuning bits for the rv8 or getting the same bhp out of the smaller cc and you struggle.

 

 

that and the 351's sound better.

[V8ian]

its only been 12 years ian no point in rushing it

i have droped out of the club but i belive the static

show is on in may

also on may 20th rwyb at north weald

Is the rwyb V8s only or for general use, at least North Weald has a bit more grip than the last airfeild I tried. Lets Pester Arlett out so we can see the vanguard on the strip,

Ian

[350moggy]

Hey Dom I voted for the yank motor they just sound so much harder than a rover. I dont know why but rovers sound a bit soft in comparison with proper american v8s unless of course you chuck a 6/71 on top and run open headers !!

[v6pop]

All V8's are expensive to rebuild.

I did a total rebuild on a Rover V8 engine last year for my Model A Pickup,I wanted this engine for its light weight but I could of built a 302 lump for much less and more power but that wasnt what I wanted.

Bear in mind what ever you get will need a rebuild (read £'s )to a lesser or greater degree.

Also more power needs a stronger drive train(gearbox/alxe/brakes),the list goes on............but do go for it,the sound of a rumbling V8 takes some beating

[V8ian]

Hey Dom I voted for the yank motor they just sound so much harder than a rover. I dont know why but rovers sound a bit soft in comparison with proper american v8s unless of course you chuck a 6/71 on top and run open headers !!

 

Obviously never heard Steve Green or TimGarlikk launch their Rover powered cars , or mine for that matter, You cant tell me a 5.0 mustang sounds HARD

[novanut64]

its only been 12 years ian no point in rushing it

i have droped out of the club but i belive the static

show is on in may

also on may 20th rwyb at north weald

Is the rwyb V8s only or for general use, at least North Weald has a bit more grip than the last airfeild I tried. Lets Pester Arlett out so we can see the vanguard on the strip,

Ian

general use ian

http://www.northwealdmotorsport.co.uk/m ... index.html

[V8Wagon]

A Rover doesn't sound hard eh?

 

You haven't heard Ian's! One of the hardest sounding cars ever.

 

I reckon there's plus' and minus' for both - A tuned Rover in a light car would go like stink - I had a V8 Cortina Mk1 about 18-months ago that flew. Best of all you wouldn't really need to move the bulkhead back to make it handle that badly.

 

The Capri's slighty different because it already has a massive engine bay so handling wouldn't be any worse than an essex - that's with a 302 and ally heads or a 351 windsor, which is the same block just has a taller deck height - 302 heads bolt straight on 'cos they're the same.

 

351 Cleveland is whole different kettle of ball games - sort of mid way between a small and big block, they are much heavier and look different too- as Ian says, they have a different firing order too. You can tell one from the other genearlly around the water pump area, where there's loads more 'land' in the block - they're much deaper than a Windsor.

You also have to ensure it is a Cleveland and not a 351M - this is a truck engine that looks identical but it ain't the same engine - much harder to tune by far because less parts are available. Although Hot Rod this month has a feature on tuning M engines.

 

Like Windsors, though, there are ally heads available for Clevelands.

 

It's also easier to fit an SBF into a Capri because a sump is readily avaialable - 5.0 Fox body Mustang sump has the majority of the bowl at the back - Team Blitz in the States do engine mounts and loads more too.

 

Windsors are more cost effective to wring power from - a lot cheaper to tune than a Rover and you'lll get far more power for less money.

However, Rovers can respond well especially 3.9's and real Steel are currently finalising their all new castings for Rovers too - loads of power!

 

I wouldn't dismiss a Rover so easily - they are proper american engines - they're Buick/Oldsmobile after all.

 

if it were me though in your Capri I'd go for SBF and if I had the choice a 351 windsor with ally heads stroked out to 408.

 

Hope that helps!

[60ftman]

None of the above.

 

My vote is for Alfa Romeo, why? well look at the technology in it that comes as standard: -

 

All Alloy light weight engine with low C of G

Dry sump

Quad Cam

Spica Fuel injection

 

Granted it's only 2.6 litres but in stock trim it is 230bhp SAE and whilst I'm not sure what can be achieved with the fuel injection, if you replace it with a triple downdraught set up with some porting and flowing of the heads etc a lot more is achieveable.

 

Oh and it's much lighter than them simplistic Yank pig iron things.

 

 

As for V8s you sat 351, C or W, totaly different engines but the heads will interchange with a bit of machining. and both engines have a different firing order, but the cams will interchange, and the later firing order on the 5.0w has the same firing order as the cleveland.

 

Cams interchange???? Between a Windsor and a Cleveland??????

Have you been looking at them through the bottom of your beer bottle, cos you've obviously been drinking.

 

Windsors and Clevelands are TOTALLY different engines. The Cleveland head was used in a much-modified form on the Boss 302 engine, but aside from that absolutely nothing else interchanges.

 

Windsor engine is largely similar in width to the Essex V6, and as it'll be a thin-wall block it probably won't weigh that much more. Difference between the 289/302 and the 351 Windsors is about 1" in the deck-height.

 

The bottom line is - it doesn't matter which Ford V8 it is, GET IT IN!

[V8ian]

None of the above.

 

My vote is for Alfa Romeo, why? well look at the technology in it that comes as standard: -

 

All Alloy light weight engine with low C of G

Dry sump

Quad Cam

Spica Fuel injection

 

Granted it's only 2.6 litres but in stock trim it is 230bhp SAE and whilst I'm not sure what can be achieved with the fuel injection, if you replace it with a triple downdraught set up with some porting and flowing of the heads etc a lot more is achieveable.

 

Oh and it's much lighter than them simplistic Yank pig iron things.

 

 

As for V8s you sat 351, C or W, totaly different engines but the heads will interchange with a bit of machining. and both engines have a different firing order, but the cams will interchange, and the later firing order on the 5.0w has the same firing order as the cleveland.

 

Cams interchange???? Between a Windsor and a Cleveland??????

Have you been looking at them through the bottom of your beer bottle, cos you've obviously been drinking.

 

Windsors and Clevelands are TOTALLY different engines. The Cleveland head was used in a much-modified form on the Boss 302 engine, but aside from that absolutely nothing else interchanges.

 

Windsor engine is largely similar in width to the Essex V6, and as it'll be a thin-wall block it probably won't weigh that much more. Difference between the 289/302 and the 351 Windsors is about 1" in the deck-height.

 

The bottom line is - it doesn't matter which Ford V8 it is, GET IT IN!

 

Absoloutly certain about the cams, when I built my 289 with 351c 2v heads, the cam profile I wanted was not available for a W and I was sold one by Tony Dickinson that was from a C

Ian