Miniliteman Posted July 17, 2023 Report Posted July 17, 2023 Don't believe everything you read on the web. Get this one from Burton and a plate to your choice. https://www.burtonpower.com/luk-clutch-cover-2-0-sohc-ford-pinto-215mm-fp273a.html
Rally Pack 2000 Posted June 24, 2024 Author Report Posted June 24, 2024 Got a email from MST that must have remembered my inquiry from last year about getting an AP Drive plate and it said they were down to their last one and were discontinued so I bit the bullet and bought it. Now just need to find a nice Pressure Cover Plate to go with it and I will be good to go. 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted June 24, 2024 Author Report Posted June 24, 2024 At one point AP and Borg and Beck were incorporated together. Ive been told AP never actually made there own cover plates so at the time these two companies were affiliated AP pressure plates were made in the UK by them. So with that if i were to purchase a NOS Borg and Beck cover plate it would be safely the same as an AP one of the same period?
Miniliteman Posted June 24, 2024 Report Posted June 24, 2024 Clutch is still listed on MST site: https://motorsport-tools.com/ap-racing-fast-road-clutch-drive-plate-escort-mk2-pinto-engine-215mm-1-x-23-sprung.html Also on other sites: https://raceandrally.com/cp5351-spring-centred-organic-driven-plate-o215mm-x-7-11 If you use another brand to AP for the cover make sure it is suited to a 7.11 mm driven plate (Helix for example uses 8.4 mm. 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted June 24, 2024 Author Report Posted June 24, 2024 1 hour ago, Miniliteman said: Clutch is still listed on MST site: https://motorsport-tools.com/ap-racing-fast-road-clutch-drive-plate-escort-mk2-pinto-engine-215mm-1-x-23-sprung.html Also on other sites: https://raceandrally.com/cp5351-spring-centred-organic-driven-plate-o215mm-x-7-11 If you use another brand to AP for the cover make sure it is suited to a 7.11 mm driven plate (Helix for example uses 8.4 mm. That's a bit cheeky of them if they still have it in stock if they told me they only had one left! I have it now anyways so just need to find a matching cover for it. See that's something I haven't heard related to buying a matching cover for it. Technically there are no actual covers made by AP themselves if I understand their history correctly so That's why I was trying to match it with a period Borg and Beck but I have no real way of telling if its suited to 7.11 or 8.4mm?
Miniliteman Posted June 28, 2024 Report Posted June 28, 2024 Not AP but LUK but could be interesting for you. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/364976021842
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 13, 2024 Author Report Posted July 13, 2024 So did some detective work and as stated above when AP owned Borg and Beck that's where their clutch covers were made while AP made their own Plates. When corporate parts of the AP group were sold off and they separated from Borg and Back hence why they dont have covers any more but kept making their plates. From the AP Borg and Beck Cover (Picture Above) for sale in Thailand, it has their part number listed for the period when they were made in the UK. 76600/11. Unfortunately being from SE Asia they have been stored in very humid conditions and it shows on their NOS. Landed here one of then would cost me the equivalent of around $400 AUS So with that number in hand for period Borg and Beck Clutch covers it became apparent that while part of the AP group they did repackage the covers for other companies using that 76600/11 Part number. Here I found Motaquip packaged one bearing that same part number and confirming its source was its instruction leaflet is also from AP. I have always found Motorquip products of the highest quality like independent Quentin Hazel before they merged and buy them NOS if I see it available. Landed this unit would have been about $300 AUS and had light rust from long storage but way better than the ones from Thailand. (High Postage was the kicker with this one) So with this clue it was clear than in that 80s period AP Distributed their British made Borg and Beck Clutch covers under various brand names. Looking at random covers I found another brand with the 76600/11 part number. One im sure many have heard from back in the day in the UK....... Unipart. So this one was the least rusted of them all, had the lowest postage and came it at $165 AUS landed to me in Australia. It was the long way around to get a period AP clutch cover but I saved hundreds in the end and got one in the best condition for an NOS cover. I enjoyed the research and history lesson but Im weird like that.
Vista Estate Posted July 13, 2024 Report Posted July 13, 2024 4 hours ago, Rally Pack 2000 said: So did some detective work and as stated above when AP owned Borg and Beck that's where their clutch covers were made while AP made their own Plates. When corporate parts of the AP group were sold off and they separated from Borg and Back hence why they dont have covers any more but kept making their plates. From the AP Borg and Beck Cover (Picture Above) for sale in Thailand, it has their part number listed for the period when they were made in the UK. 76600/11. Unfortunately being from SE Asia they have been stored in very humid conditions and it shows on their NOS. Landed here one of then would cost me the equivalent of around $400 AUS So with that number in hand for period Borg and Beck Clutch covers it became apparent that while part of the AP group they did repackage the covers for other companies using that 76600/11 Part number. Here I found Motaquip packaged one bearing that same part number and confirming its source was its instruction leaflet is also from AP. I have always found Motorquip products of the highest quality like independent Quentin Hazel before they merged and buy them NOS if I see it available. Landed this unit would have been about $300 AUS and had light rust from long storage but way better than the ones from Thailand. (High Postage was the kicker with this one) So with this clue it was clear than in that 80s period AP Distributed their British made Borg and Beck Clutch covers under various brand names. Looking at random covers I found another brand with the 76600/11 part number. One im sure many have heard from back in the day in the UK....... Unipart. So this one was the least rusted of them all, had the lowest postage and came it at $165 AUS landed to me in Australia. It was the long way around to get a period AP clutch cover but I saved hundreds in the end and got one in the best condition for an NOS cover. I enjoyed the research and history lesson but Im weird like that. Wow, @Rally Pack 2000you are now the clutch guru. Did you manage to sort out the viewing window in the bell housing so you could display your clutch at shows 🤣. 2
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 13, 2024 Author Report Posted July 13, 2024 15 minutes ago, Vista Estate said: Wow, @Rally Pack 2000you are now the clutch guru. Did you manage to sort out the viewing window in the bell housing so you could display your clutch at shows 🤣. Definitely not! Just got there out of desperation and being a cheapskate! Hey Bikes have them why cant we?!!! 1 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 13, 2024 Author Report Posted July 13, 2024 Is there any reason that modern cover plates have much longer diaphragm spring levers than older ones? I tried web searching but no one mentions it but the center of modern cover plates are much larger than period ones. Is one better than the other or is it just to lower costs or something?
Miniliteman Posted July 13, 2024 Report Posted July 13, 2024 Do you mean the fingers of the diaphragm? Modern clutches are bigger in diameter and longer fingers mean lesser force needed to operate the clutch. 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 13, 2024 Author Report Posted July 13, 2024 3 hours ago, Miniliteman said: Do you mean the fingers of the diaphragm? Modern clutches are bigger in diameter and longer fingers mean lesser force needed to operate the clutch. Yes thats what I was referring too.
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 19, 2024 Author Report Posted July 19, 2024 On 13/07/2024 at 22:47, Miniliteman said: Do you mean the fingers of the diaphragm? Modern clutches are bigger in diameter and longer fingers mean lesser force needed to operate the clutch. So it just makes for a lighter clutch then? I never found a standard Escort clutch particularly heavy though. Is there any disadvantages to these modern clutches? Are they as strong or last as long?
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 22, 2024 Author Report Posted July 22, 2024 So do you think these Original Ford Motorcraft Clutch bearings are really Chinese? As Katana pointed out although Germany is prominently printed on it you can see "INA" with the start of the word cut out to the right at the 4 o'clock position? The wrap paper is made in England! LOL
Miniliteman Posted July 22, 2024 Report Posted July 22, 2024 Who said they were Chinese? INA is INA Bearings from Germany a well known company for their quality parts. 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 23, 2024 Author Report Posted July 23, 2024 19 hours ago, Miniliteman said: Who said they were Chinese? INA is INA Bearings from Germany a well known company for their quality parts. LOL It was a joke made earlier in this thread but with so much manufacturing being transferred to China these days it was a real possibility! But your reply was exactly what I wanted to know. Was it the end of the word China or did INA stand for something, which it does! So did this INA group also have a factory in France? Earlier in this thread there is a picture of another one but references Lizenz Verto France as well as the INA Germany markings.
Rally Pack 2000 Posted July 23, 2024 Author Report Posted July 23, 2024 Interestingly is that the appear to still make them today!
Tommyturbo Posted August 8, 2024 Report Posted August 8, 2024 Iv just come across this thread and I run this clutch in my pinto mk1 escort and it is super strong use the car hard driving drifting and burnouts ect but it is stupid heavy prob the stiffest clutch Iv ever felt in a escort or pinto powered car 1
Rally Pack 2000 Posted August 9, 2024 Author Report Posted August 9, 2024 20 hours ago, Tommyturbo said: Iv just come across this thread and I run this clutch in my pinto mk1 escort and it is super strong use the car hard driving drifting and burnouts ect but it is stupid heavy prob the stiffest clutch Iv ever felt in a escort or pinto powered car Thats sounds like it would be a bit too heavy for a standard car. Are you using their race one or they fast road one? Did you buy it when their kit was still available so you have their cover (pressure) plate as well? Welcome to the forum by the way it was great you joint to give some input to this thread on your first post. Greatly appreciated.
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